Re: I'm sick of it
Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:38 pm
Welcome to both of you. A wealth of information here and vent away. This group understand a lot of the issue. Well said Inconinmiss about
MikePNW wrote:Once you truly get your head and your emotions around the idea that diapers are part of the solution and not part of the problem, you can lead an essentially normal life; and incontinence becomes not much more than a minor nuisance that you can manage effectively.
Re: I'm sick of it
Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:02 pm
Hi Noe,
You're right in that I know most here have had similar experiences. I have followed along here for a long time learning that I'm not alone, but not ready to share my problems with anyone other than those I hold closest. I wrote most of that rant Friday evening after having an accident while out having dinner with friends, and friends of friends, and being stuck, outed, and humiliated. Not by anyone present. I suppose they were as supportive as they could be. But I didn't want their sympathy. I was angry. With myself and with my condition. Writing the first three paragraphs was a cathartic release of that anger. I almost deleted it the following morning, but instead wrote the last paragraph, then worked up the nerve to do something with it.
I suppose this may end up being my "never let your guard down" (bad pun semi-intended
) learning experience. Even if my symptoms have been in a lull for a few weeks.
Patrick,
Am I in denial? Maybe. It doesn't feel like it to me. I left out a lot of details. Resigning my self to wearing some form of protection when visiting clients because the risk is just too high (that came after the train incident). I haven't traveled more than an hour from home without wearing, and/or carrying extra with me in about a year now. Most the information on being prepared I've learned from you all. But at home and in the neighborhood where trips are short and available bathrooms are readily known, it's very easy to become complacent knowing accidents are rare because I have almost always had some warning that symptoms were going to flare up again. Observations from a 3rd party with similar experiences can always be insightful. I'll have to think more about it.
Matthew,
Perhaps this line of yours speaks to my fears more than any other, and I'm not sure you meant it this way:
"Protection helps you take back control where control was lost, rather than {...} giving up hope that it won't be an issue"
Because at this point, for me, resorting to wearing protection feels like giving up hope. Giving up on being "normal" again. I've read just about everything here and understand, in an academic sense, the control protection can return. But getting over ingrained societal taboo of bladder control and "diapers" is extremely difficult when it moves from being an abstract exercise to being your life.
I understand your difficulty with the fit of pull ups. I like the idea of them since almost all of the time I can make it to restroom. But the placement of the padding on the one's I've tried is not exactly in line with the male anatomy so leaks are common, especially while sitting down. My only dislike of fitted briefs is that they are a commitment. Once on, you're committed. I haven't successfully managed the "pull it out a leg and go" maneuver without peeing all over the place. To their credit, they are very good at their job.
Rob and mlhjr,
I just transferred to a new urologist at UCSF. He's supposed to be their incontinence expert and was the one with the new diagnosis of BPH. Though I have my doubts, I understand that doctors have to work through the process of eliminating the most probable causes of symptoms first based on what they can observe and that this process takes time. That doesn't make it any easier. Since BPH was not diagnosed by my first urologist, it's back to flowmax for a while and when that doesn't work again (I was on flowmax for a while to see if it helped my symptoms), we'll move forward. We'll see what the word is in June.
MikePNW,
I'm actually most glad to hear from you. Our experiences are virtually identical. For two years now, I've been told "kidney stones don't cause incontinence", but no other definitive diagnosis was forthcoming. My first urologist progressed following the same theory as you postulate: Stones form, fragments break off and pass through the ureters, bladder, and urethra causing irritation along the way which leads to urgency, frequency and leaks. I had ESWL last summer and they finally blasted the stone out. Much pain, blood, sweat, and tears later there is no stone left. My cytoscopy and CT scan last month showed no trace of stones and I have had no back/flank pain since the ESWL, but the cytoscopy showed a slightly enlarged prostate surrounding an otherwise normal bladder and urethra.
I remember reading on another site regarding OAB, that they are beginning to believe that once the detrusor muscle is irritated enough, that the hypersensitivity can remain long after the irritant is gone. And that's my working pet theory,
I consider myself quite fortunate that night time is a relatively calm time for me. I do wake up 2-3 times a night to go, but at least I have not (yet) peed on my partner.
Best wishes.
Everyone else, thank you for your support and thoughts. My rantiness is over. But the triggering event has brought my symptoms back in full force. At least for a while. I'm sure they'll subside again. But maybe next time I won't let me guard down.
You're right in that I know most here have had similar experiences. I have followed along here for a long time learning that I'm not alone, but not ready to share my problems with anyone other than those I hold closest. I wrote most of that rant Friday evening after having an accident while out having dinner with friends, and friends of friends, and being stuck, outed, and humiliated. Not by anyone present. I suppose they were as supportive as they could be. But I didn't want their sympathy. I was angry. With myself and with my condition. Writing the first three paragraphs was a cathartic release of that anger. I almost deleted it the following morning, but instead wrote the last paragraph, then worked up the nerve to do something with it.
I suppose this may end up being my "never let your guard down" (bad pun semi-intended
) learning experience. Even if my symptoms have been in a lull for a few weeks.Patrick,
Am I in denial? Maybe. It doesn't feel like it to me. I left out a lot of details. Resigning my self to wearing some form of protection when visiting clients because the risk is just too high (that came after the train incident). I haven't traveled more than an hour from home without wearing, and/or carrying extra with me in about a year now. Most the information on being prepared I've learned from you all. But at home and in the neighborhood where trips are short and available bathrooms are readily known, it's very easy to become complacent knowing accidents are rare because I have almost always had some warning that symptoms were going to flare up again. Observations from a 3rd party with similar experiences can always be insightful. I'll have to think more about it.
Matthew,
Perhaps this line of yours speaks to my fears more than any other, and I'm not sure you meant it this way:
"Protection helps you take back control where control was lost, rather than {...} giving up hope that it won't be an issue"
Because at this point, for me, resorting to wearing protection feels like giving up hope. Giving up on being "normal" again. I've read just about everything here and understand, in an academic sense, the control protection can return. But getting over ingrained societal taboo of bladder control and "diapers" is extremely difficult when it moves from being an abstract exercise to being your life.
I understand your difficulty with the fit of pull ups. I like the idea of them since almost all of the time I can make it to restroom. But the placement of the padding on the one's I've tried is not exactly in line with the male anatomy so leaks are common, especially while sitting down. My only dislike of fitted briefs is that they are a commitment. Once on, you're committed. I haven't successfully managed the "pull it out a leg and go" maneuver without peeing all over the place. To their credit, they are very good at their job.
Rob and mlhjr,
I just transferred to a new urologist at UCSF. He's supposed to be their incontinence expert and was the one with the new diagnosis of BPH. Though I have my doubts, I understand that doctors have to work through the process of eliminating the most probable causes of symptoms first based on what they can observe and that this process takes time. That doesn't make it any easier. Since BPH was not diagnosed by my first urologist, it's back to flowmax for a while and when that doesn't work again (I was on flowmax for a while to see if it helped my symptoms), we'll move forward. We'll see what the word is in June.
MikePNW,
I'm actually most glad to hear from you. Our experiences are virtually identical. For two years now, I've been told "kidney stones don't cause incontinence", but no other definitive diagnosis was forthcoming. My first urologist progressed following the same theory as you postulate: Stones form, fragments break off and pass through the ureters, bladder, and urethra causing irritation along the way which leads to urgency, frequency and leaks. I had ESWL last summer and they finally blasted the stone out. Much pain, blood, sweat, and tears later there is no stone left. My cytoscopy and CT scan last month showed no trace of stones and I have had no back/flank pain since the ESWL, but the cytoscopy showed a slightly enlarged prostate surrounding an otherwise normal bladder and urethra.
I remember reading on another site regarding OAB, that they are beginning to believe that once the detrusor muscle is irritated enough, that the hypersensitivity can remain long after the irritant is gone. And that's my working pet theory,
I consider myself quite fortunate that night time is a relatively calm time for me. I do wake up 2-3 times a night to go, but at least I have not (yet) peed on my partner.
Best wishes.
Everyone else, thank you for your support and thoughts. My rantiness is over. But the triggering event has brought my symptoms back in full force. At least for a while. I'm sure they'll subside again. But maybe next time I won't let me guard down.
Re: I'm sick of it
Sun Apr 03, 2016 11:25 pm
MikeInSF wrote:Matthew,
Perhaps this line of yours speaks to my fears more than any other, and I'm not sure you meant it this way:
"Protection helps you take back control where control was lost, rather than {...} giving up hope that it won't be an issue"
Because at this point, for me, resorting to wearing protection feels like giving up hope. Giving up on being "normal" again. I've read just about everything here and understand, in an academic sense, the control protection can return. But getting over ingrained societal taboo of bladder control and "diapers" is extremely difficult when it moves from being an abstract exercise to being your life.
I understand your difficulty with the fit of pull ups. I like the idea of them since almost all of the time I can make it to restroom. But the placement of the padding on the one's I've tried is not exactly in line with the male anatomy so leaks are common, especially while sitting down. My only dislike of fitted briefs is that they are a commitment. Once on, you're committed. I haven't successfully managed the "pull it out a leg and go" maneuver without peeing all over the place. To their credit, they are very good at their job.
I can understand your feeling very well. I get that feeling a lot and find myself switching back to pull-ups or even regular underwear every now and again to convince myself that my problems are manageable and that I'm normal. What actually winds up happening is that I end up with physical discomfort, anxiety, dehydration, and inevitably, wet underwear and pants. I have denied that my issues were in fact issues for a long time, and only started wearing the "guards for men" about a year ago, despite having issues since I was likely 24 or 25 years old. (I'm 28 now, for the record)
Resorting to protection, especially fitted briefs or diapers as they are called, has been the solution while I'm trying to navigate through the medical system to get treatment. It is far from giving up for me. I am not giving up trying to find the underlying cause to this. I got bloodwork done and I have no problems with my prostate (that I know), with diabetes, or a UTI. I am trying to see a urologist, but am finding trouble as my doctor wants me to reach a certain BMI and quit smoking before he stops shrugging my issues off. Frequency problems have likely been an issue since I was a kid, and leakage since my mid-20's. But I know this isn't the end, but I need to manage in the meantime. I can't give up living in the meantime either. Diapers or Fitted briefs allow me to be normal, that is, I can drink water and be hydrated, I can go out for a beer with my friends, I can participate in sports and martial arts, I can work without being anxious. I'm just wearing an appropriate solution to address the problem that I have, not "giving up" at all.
I guess I'm a bit early in my acceptance of this so I can't word my feelings very well on the subject, but I feel as if by trying to avoid wearing protection is like trying to avoid admitting that there is a problem at all, or believing that your problems are not nearly as bad as they are. It is essentially denial. Once you are able to confront your problems and admit the true severity of the situation, then you are able to properly address it with protection that fits your needs a lot better. The added benefit is the return to normalcy as stated in the above paragraph, as well as the lack of humiliating situations and embarrassing moments that not wearing adequate protection causes. I talk as someone who deals with the frustration and anxiety with accepting the issue right now, not as someone with years of experience dealing with proper management of incontinence, but it is getting easier for me as I continue to do the things that I enjoy doing without fear or anxiety to accept the severity of my problem and the relief a proper management solution gives me.
In regards to your concern about the "commitment" of diapers, I think I had the same feeling. It is like, once you are in a diaper, you are in a diaper, there is no turning back or no getting out of it. I have found recently that that belief is largely an irrational one. I am not sure where the thought stemmed from to be honest. The thread here, From pull-ups to fitted briefs, has a lot of great information regarding the subject, but I'll point out Brian's post on page 3 of the thread.
I've never found this to be an issue for me. I wear tapped on disposable diapers, but also pull them down to use the toilet for bowel movements. As long as you tape them on so the diaper is snug- not tight- then you should also be able to pull them down over your hips. That is of course, unless you have very wide hips.
You won't be able to just slide them down like you can with a underwear or a pullup though. To do it, pull down the back, of your diaper a few inches and just below your cheeks, bend forward at the waist some, then pull down the front of the diaper. Once it is past your hips and cheeks, the diaper will slide off the rest of the way.
To put it back on (assuming it isn't very wet and you want to), just follow the same steps in reverse. Lean forward at the waist and pull the diaper up to just above your hips in the front. Stand up straight and pull the back of the diaper over your cheeks. Rework the top of the diaper front and back to get it back in the right spot. Now also push up and rework the leg bands to get them in the right spot too.
There is more information in that thread regarding the topic, but his method works very well. You can still use the restroom when you need to go, but you have enough protection to support you for any kind of leak, dribble, or worse, unexpected flood. The modularity with the fit on fitted briefs will provide most any kind of fit that you need and make it very comfortable, at least more so than a pullup. I regularly use the bathroom and very rarely have full blown floods, but I do dribble when I need to go and after I go, as well as deal with frequent urination (20-25 times a day), and I wear fitted briefs or diapers in addition to it.
I apologize for the long post, but I hope I am able to make sense and that this is helpful to you. I wish you luck.
Re: I'm sick of it
Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:08 am
Wearing diapers for incontinence isn't giving up. It's quite the opposite, and is facing your problem by accepting and/or finally working toward the needed solution.
I can absolutely relate to the urge incontinence and seemingly randomness to it (mine were also extremely painful- every hour or so). Ultimately for me it came down to at least trying to improve my quality of life. Wearing diapers 24/7 for me also meant no more wet pants or rushing to the toilet, and the ability to go out again- and for long periods of time.
In fact, eliminating my urges also meant allowing my bladder to constantly drain by surgically removing my sphincter muscles (which I am still in the process of having done). I now have mostly no control and constantly wet my diaper, but with the added benefit of not having any more painful urges, or being a slave to the toilet. This is not because I gave up, but because I actively moved forward in seeking a solution to my problems in order to make my life better.
While this may not be the answer for you, I do hope it at least shows that diapers are anything but giving up.
I can absolutely relate to the urge incontinence and seemingly randomness to it (mine were also extremely painful- every hour or so). Ultimately for me it came down to at least trying to improve my quality of life. Wearing diapers 24/7 for me also meant no more wet pants or rushing to the toilet, and the ability to go out again- and for long periods of time.
In fact, eliminating my urges also meant allowing my bladder to constantly drain by surgically removing my sphincter muscles (which I am still in the process of having done). I now have mostly no control and constantly wet my diaper, but with the added benefit of not having any more painful urges, or being a slave to the toilet. This is not because I gave up, but because I actively moved forward in seeking a solution to my problems in order to make my life better.
While this may not be the answer for you, I do hope it at least shows that diapers are anything but giving up.