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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 1:16 am 
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Having a lot of down time after my surgery I have been catching up on some of the older post and a reoccurring theme I am seeing is how we cope and interact with others, specifically with those in the realm of the ABDL. Questions are being asked from both sides and I wanted to take a few moments to reflect on both sides and why there seems to be a tension coming from both sides.
Now granted, I am no psychology major and only have an opinion from my personal experience and think I have a good idea why there continues to be a divide. First things first, there are many shades to each side of this topic. From the newly incontinent person, scared and unsure what life would be like and​ assuming that any joke or comment referencing diapers or incontinence is directed towards them in the most demeaning way possible to some one that has accepted his/her bodily qurks and has accepted life for what it is. Also from a person that is purely fixated on their an personal and sexual satisfaction to a person that is still concerned with others and feels they may be in a position to help others with the knowledge they have gained during their life with this fetish. Again, remember there are many shades for each of these people and sometimes these two paths cross.

Now, I can speak from personal experience that especially when someone was normal and thrown into the world of incontinence, that the attack on ones self-esteem and self view can be intense. I went from being so scared and humiliated to go out thinking the world would be able to tell what I had on and think of me as weak and feeble and also wanting to quit my job because of how I ultimately viewed myself and even to the point of pondering suicide. Things didn't help when I turned to the internet for answers just to learn how big the fetish world is and again another fear that I would be associated with this group I don't understand and made me feel even more like less of a person due to my inexperience. I quickly developed an DEEP hatred for those in the abdl world because again, I felt like they were somehow perpetuating the stigma of diapers and getting sexual gratification from me in my situation. This is one reason I think some people and most doctors look down on diapers as a viable option to manage incontinence. Again, look at me for example, both me and my doctor's put the option on the table for surgically placing a catheter through the abdomen and removing the bladder completely which would also have taken the prostate and the ability to have a normal sex life with my wife at the age of 38. Looking back now I can only stand in awe at how close I was to that reality just to keep from having to wear a diaper. That is how strong the fear and the stigma can be.
I can only imagine that is the norm for how some cope with this but I have been around long enough to also know that some out there are not so self conscious and have a stronger disposition and adjust a lot quicker and see things more clear and faster. Some adjust quickly and move on as nothing is wrong. But also from my experience, those type of people don't stay with an online forum very long or even at all because they don't need that kind of support especially from outside sources.
Now to the other side of the coin, we have the abdl. From what I have learned over we the years, this group can be equally diverse ranging from a person that is only fixated on their own sexual satisfaction with little to no empathy for those around them to those people that have an unknown reason to themselves of why diapers excite them but are still caring and thoughtful people that turn out to have an unusual fetish.
Now, to muddy the waters even more, there are those that live in both worlds. For whatever reason they are incontinent and still are able to find part of the situation as pleasurable. I have spoken to both kinds of people They had a fetish for diapers and later became incontinent and those that somehow were able to find something positive. Kind of like looking for a silver lining.
You see, this subject is very complex and has many angles but where I think things start to begin to clear up is where on the internet you are. For the most part, the people here are medically incontinent and looking for answers and support from people they do not view as threatening. That is the focus here and why the mods try so hard to not let that line blur. But without fail we get those people that are looking to pretend and get there jollies off. What is funny about this, those of us that have been around the block a few times can spot those that would have us think they are one of the medically incontinent ones and have a right to be here. Some think we are to stupid or that it is nothing more then a game. The first one that comes to mind was this person that joined a few years ago pretending to be severely disabled and just wanting friends but would post pictures of a disposable bed pad asking what size it was. This person ended up getting band and a day or two later registered again with a new name with another back ground story. We immediately knew it was the same person but let it go for a few days to see where things went. I later called him out again and told him not to come back. This is the behavior that causes the distrust and distaste for the fetish community by those that are already struggling to find peace with this condition.
To this point is where I want to ask the community for their understanding and assistance. First call out is to anyone thinking about joining for the soul purpose to indulge in a fantasy of having to wear a diaper. You are playing with people that are struggling with something very deep and personal. Some may be on the verge of depression and saying the wrong thing could almost push them over the edge. The perfect example of this is he first forum I joined(not Depend) I had some one message me thinking they were helping say I was so lucky to be incontinent and have an excuse to wear a diaper all the time. I started out hating him but later turned that anger in words. Looking back, he was trying to help me find a bright side but that was from his point of view and from a stance of a abdl person.
The next are those that walk both sides of this debate. Please think of those here that are struggling before you post. For that matter, think before you sign up. If you are incontinent and want to be supportive, don't, for the love of God choose a screen name like "Diaper Dave", Nappy_times", Bottle_Fed or even BabyBrian. Can you see how you are setting yourself up for distrust and conflict before you even make your first post. Now Brian, please don't take this personally. I am using you only as an example. Brian has made some contributions here but you are hurting your credibility first with the name and the continued discussion of your fetish side. It turns people off and takes away from the ultimate goal of this forum, to be a safe place for those that are struggling with this condition to find answers and support and the biggest thing, to not feel alone.
There are hundreds of other sites and forums dedicated to the fetish side and the input there is not only welcomed but encouraged.
My next suggestion is to the mods and especially schoppy. We need to stop approving new members with questionable screen names. For example, the last 5 names I would have kicked or at least asked them to change would be names like terrynappies, OldLeaky, theusofpee, Diaperedhawk and diaperdan7365. Those are just the last five in my opinion should have been asked to choose something different. We as moderators have a responsibility to keep this a safe and welcoming community. The other thing we need to do is try to be more of a filter for trash that is questionable. Yes, I am aware there are good products out there being sold right next to products geared for Abdls and that is where we need to step in and watch how things unfold. A good example of this is Angelfluff cloth diapers. In my opinion, they have some of the best cloth diapers out there with the most options in sizing but they also sell plastic covers with prints. That is not the kind of thing that needs to be flonted around here but it is a business and they are out to make money so they can sell what they want but they do have products that are safe from that part of things. Other companies primarily sell to the abdl world and we may need to limit some of that stuff. An excellent example of this point are products like Bambino diapers. I have read the praises of many say these are the best and most absorbent but the fact that they are sold with prints on the diapers is a line that we can't cross. There are plenty of other super absorbent diapers out there without having to go there.
This is a site and a forum for those new to incontinence to feel safe and not so alone and most of all like they are not drowning in sexual deviancy. Our goal is to help those feel comfortable with who they are and eventually comfortable with seeking the best product for their own situation. Another example of this is when I first tried cloth diapers. The first few years I viewed cloth as being only for the fetish world and not practical in any way. After reading here and getting input from members I had built a relationship with I began to explore those options and learned the qualities cloth had to offer and was thrilled with the level of protection and comfort they could offer. For those that are now where I was then, just the idea of being able to safely sleep on my side again was a God send.

There is a time for everything and also a time to draw a line in the sand and say, "no more!". Remember who we are trying to help here and keep the focus there. I guess my ultimate goal for our members here is 1)to be a supportive resource for those new to this path 2) get people comfortable enough with their own bodies and self image to be comfortable with exploring the many choices we have for treatment, management and types of protection and above all else 3) get our members to a point where they don't need to resort to an online forum to feel better about themselves or how they want to manage their own incontinence. I want to see everyone get to the point where they can move on and be happy!

That is just my two cents.

Rope


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 1:53 am 
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Rope_Wrench wrote:
"wall of great Text removed"

There is a time for everything and also a time to draw a line in the sand and say, "no more!". Remember who we are trying to help here and keep the focus there. I guess my ultimate goal for our members here is 1)to be a supportive resource for those new to this path 2) get people comfortable enough with their own bodies and self image to be comfortable with exploring the many choices we have for treatment, management and types of protection and above all else 3) get our members to a point where they don't need to resort to an online forum to feel better about themselves or how they want to manage their own incontinence. I want to see everyone get to the point where they can move on and be happy!

That is just my two cents.

Rope


Thank you. for that. I am very hesitant to discuss this issue with anyone outside a dedicated place to do so. I have blocked posts from members here for the above issues.
and I will remain mostly in the shadow reading away until this place is safer


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 7:11 am 
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Hi Rope

I agree 100% this site should be safe for people to open up about IC issues and to get information on the best ways to manage Incontinent issues the members here have really helped me over the time I have been a member to deal with my OAB issue.

Being able to talk openly with people who are going though the same or simmualer issues as I am has really helped me come to terms with being incontinent and the need for wearing diapers 24/7

Proper screen names are important part of of keeping the site on track of supporting medical incontinence issues.

New and existing members have a hard enough time coming to terms with needing adult diapers for a medical issue with out reading screen names or signatures that imply that some members want to be incontinent and wear diapers for fun.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:32 am 
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Interesting and well written post. I agree with almost everything you have mentioned, Rope_Wrench, with the exception of only a couple things. One being kinds of screen names. I don't understand why we even need to have a screen name. What's wrong with using our first names? After all, I assume we are all mature adults, and here for support of some kind. I guess I would personally like to address someone by their actual name. I have a screen name. It's dp66, but my real name is Dennis. No offense, but what's a Rope_Wrench? I don't feel using our actual given name is revealing anything too personal. You also mentioned that some purchase their diapers from ADBL sites. I would be one of those. I have purchased diapers from many incontinent supply sites, and still do on occasion. I have found a couple of the ADBL sites have products that fit me much better. They do provide all white versions of their diapers which is what I buy...not a fan of prints either. I'm not sure if I will need diapers for the rest of my life or not...I'll be 70 in a few weeks. It all depends on how I recover from my prostatectomy and diverticulotomy. Since I had been having incontinence issues before my surgery, I'm not real confident of being completely continent ever again. Either way, life goes on. A good friend of mine once told me "getting old is not for sissies.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 11:01 am 
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Location: Jacksonville Fl
Rope_wrench, I do agree with a majority of what you're saying. However, a major part of why I originally choose my screen name as I did, was because of something you just incorrectly mentioned (no offense), and is a prelavent misconception throughout society.

ABDL is NOT a fetish. By definition, loving diapers is no more a fetish than loving people. And just like with loving a person, this is simply something we did not choose. We are however ostracised for it on an almost daily basis.

Yes there absolutely are people out there with nothing more than a diaper fetish, but please do not confuse them with the abdl community at large. For those few, I totally get where you're coming from and why you would have disdain for them. Believe it or not, I do as well. It is these few "bad apples" that have given us the bad associations you know of and feel.

However, I refuse to let those few dictate how I am going to be treated. In most every case I refuse to hide who I am (and this is very much an integral part of who I am, more so than being incontinent), nor do I stand to allow anyone call what I have to deal with as being a fetish. This is why I chose my screen name, and only after being threatened with banning because of those misconceptions did I relent.

And yes, part of those misconceptions is general societies view that anything diaper related must be avoided at ANY cost for all adults. Even at the risk of a potentially serious yet unnecessary surgery. As you've found, that is just plain silly.

Does that mean we should cater to that same misconception here as well. Personally I'd say no, but I do get your wanting to at least be "tactful yet corrective" with those others until they come around. I see this no different with the fetish/abdl belief. Hence part of the reason why I did change my user name for here after all. And why I've promised not to bring this subject up unless addressing someone else who already has.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 12:40 pm 
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Brian,
You crossed the line. This is not a forum to defend or justify the FETISHES you are speaking of.

**BAND**


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 3:46 pm 
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I guess, for me, there is loving diapers and there is loving diapers. I need diapers for the same reason I need glasses or hearing aids, or, when my inner ear disease is acting up, a walker or a wheelchair. I simply could not function in public without them. But loving quickly turns to hatred when I have an accident. I value my independence too much to enjoy having anyone else assist me with my incontinence chores. Because of my brain injury, brain tumor, and the inner ear disease, I walk like a drunk. This grabs the attention of by-standers, so they usually miss my trousers bulge. It is a welcome distraction. For me, diapers are a necessary evil, one that I wish I could do without. Making peace with a situation I cannot change may or may not be love. It simply is.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 4:07 pm 
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Thank you dp66. You have good points about where we buy stuff and I hope some of our newer or more in need of adjusting members and see how someone can get to a point where finding a product that works more then we'll but great is a goal we we should strive for. As for the names, that is something I can also agree with but there are a few issues that would be problematic. First, you have a very common first name. You maintain a high level of anonymity. I have a very uncommon name and with one or two more details you could Google me fairly easy. Another reason the screen names work is what if we have more then one or two or even three members with the same name. I know for certain that we have another Dennis and he is also comfortable with signing his post with his name. The screen name will allow those that fear outing themselves a level of comfort to discuss things that are very uncomfortable.
As for my screen name, Rope_Wrench, it come from the work that I do. I teach rope work and rope rescue work and a rope wrench is a slang term for a knife.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 4:48 pm 
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Ah! Good points. Very clever way of coming up with a screen name.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 6:12 pm 
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Thank you, Rope_Wrench. I participate in this forum both as a patient and as a caregiver. As a patient, I am grateful for the quality of the information contained in the archived posts. Forum members are, in my experience, almost universally professional in their communications with each other. As a caregiver, I must admit that I have never shared this forum with other members of my team. There is just too much material in the archives that would reflect poorly on my reputation if I were to cite the forum in a professional context. Unlike other online discussion groups -- say, groups devoted to cancer or heart disease -- incontinentsupport.org deals with an issue that can be approached from more than one point of view. That makes our community vulnerable to users with their own agendas. Personally, I would welcome some reforms. Initially, I would propose setting forth a clear statement of purpose: this is a forum for people who need to discuss medical incontinence. I strongly concur with your exhortations concerning usernames. I feel that usernames need not be real names; however, they should be the sort of names we would feel comfortable using at work or in church. Further, it might be helpful to institute a user agreement/contract that specifies words and topics that we do not discuss here. Moderators will always face borderline cases; however, clear guidelines allow for consistent decision-making. Finally, my thanks to everyone who "keeps it clean" in their writings while still offering candid information. You are the reason I return to this place.


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